MOTORPSYCHO -- Centralstation, Darmstadt (Germany), 14.05.2006, Audience DAT - available on Etree

Damnit. I really enjoyed those remastered versions as I wouldn't care less about .flacs, I just care about the sound. I can't here the difference, but GBD's remastered ones did sound than the others. I was still waiting patiently for the second part of the Molde Jazz recording and all. Why the big fuss? Can't the ones who prefer the remastered recordings just download them and listen to them on our mp3-players whenever we want? Why would you care?

I totally agree Laika. But GBD is right, they've ruined the fun. I'm gettin' the flac out of this thread.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/01/2006 06:18PM by Earle.

this discussion has become quite bizarre and i'm totally with gblissarddemon and Be. it does seem to be about a "code of honor" of some sort but... what? the band has the say, so let's not start any moral debate. why should the taper have any more rights to spread than the remaster guy? gimme a break.

i enjoy a "bettered" mix. can't see why anyone should not. and i don't care if i did it or somebody else.
GBdemon offered a bettered version. properly declared and he even proposed a song to everyone to check first because of some treble issues... i mean what's the problem? you want it? get it. prefer to listen the original authentic recording? leave it. but i've said that before.

jeez, i've written more but i scrap it. this is becoming way too weird.
just one thing: bad sound does not equal authenticity.

and i gotta get ready for tonight's dinosaur jr show anyway.

and i won't tape it.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/01/2006 07:16PM by supernaut.

to the critical people: Dont you think of the people who cant afford a 750 MB download just for the minimal difference between flac and mp3? Those people with bandwidth limits or 56k modems...

hi folks,

i think it's about time to throw my two cents in here. i am the taper of this show and i was not amused(to say the least) about my recording being seeded on etree.org. the main reason for this is that MP are very concerned of the danger, that one day commercial bootlegs of these recordings might show up. MP are quite cool with taping and trading, as far it is kept small/private and not on a "public" torrent tracker like etree. however, i cleared things up with the one who seeded it and he promised me to ask me before he seeds one of my recordings again.
the other thing is, that i was quite annoyed about the fact, that someone even converted it to mp3 and "remastered" it. i don't want to sound rude, but if you don't like my recording, just do not listen to it. please,goldenblissarddemon,i know that your intentions are good, but if you feel like converting a recording into shitty formats like mp3and/or "remaster" it, do so for yr own purposes, but please do not spread it that way. always keep it in the original lossless FLAC or SHN format.

concerning sound quality in general: i don't know how familiar you are with live recordings, but: this is an audience recording. it can never sound as good as professionally recorded things like (for example) the roadworks albums. you have to keep this in mind. to me the sound of this recording is quite average, although i admit, that i was a little disappointed on how it turned out too. i did better recordings in the past, but i also heard some much weaker stuff before. i have been trading and taping for about 15 years now, so i can call myself quite experienced in that.

well, as i said, just my two cents.

--a.

oh well whatever nevermind!
have fun, do whatever you want to do, don't do whatever you don't want to do!

let's shut up, smile and enjoy the music. (and be nice,
say thanks, "credit where credit is due", as Bent said)

some words of wisdom:

HAVE FUN

Too many toys in attic can make you go blind
but there’s a lot of things to hide behind
There’s a veil of illusions to mirror the glares
and to keep away the fears
that hide behind the stairs

wow,here you are again!
so cool out on the burning sand
will the heat fry away your fears?
wait and see if I even care...
Have Fun

Now it’s four past midnight and you ghosts are all out
there’s no telling what it’s all about
throw them a dime and they will show you the way
out of your wishing well-to heaven,or was it hell?

wow,here you are again!
so cool out on the burning sand
will the heat fry away your fears?
wait and see if I even care...
Have Fun

jtr Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I got it and will check it out as soon as Un Chien
> has finished (btw, very funny: at ca. 29:00 a guy
> shouts of excitement, and another one replies:
> "'Maul!" - (shut your) mouth! ...lol)


that was actually me, telling the guy standing next to me to shut up, as he was screaming directly into my right ear

--a.

NOTE: the "have fun"-post was not ment as a direct reply to the taper's post!

kornyfone Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> hi folks,
>
> i think it's about time to throw my two cents in
> here. i am the taper of this show and i was not
> amused(to say the least) about my recording being
> seeded on etree.org. the main reason for this is...

OH SHITE! Is it really you, allmighty taper...? OH MY.....!!!!!! AH! ALL HAIL THE MIGHTY TAPER!! WE LOVE YOU TAPER!!

Hmmm....taper...in norwegian that word means......awww forget it.

@Earle

Take it easy. No need to get rude on Anders. He is the one who provided everyone with that recording. Wheter you like flac/mp3 or remastered versions. Without him taping it, we wouldn't even have something to argue about. LOL.

I am glad, I can listen to that recording. Period.

kornyfone Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> hi folks,
>
> i think it's about time to throw my two cents in
> here. i am the taper of this show and i was not
> amused(to say the least) about my recording being
> seeded on etree.org. the main reason for this is
> that MP are very concerned of the danger, that one
> day commercial bootlegs of these recordings might
> show up. MP are quite cool with taping and
> trading, as far it is kept small/private and not
> on a "public" torrent tracker like etree. however,
> i cleared things up with the one who seeded it and
> he promised me to ask me before he seeds one of my
> recordings again.
> the other thing is, that i was quite annoyed about
> the fact, that someone even converted it to mp3
> and "remastered" it. i don't want to sound rude,
> but if you don't like my recording, just do not
> listen to it. please,goldenblissarddemon,i know
> that your intentions are good, but if you feel
> like converting a recording into shitty formats
> like mp3and/or "remaster" it, do so for yr own
> purposes, but please do not spread it that way.
> always keep it in the original lossless FLAC or
> SHN format.
>
> concerning sound quality in general: i don't know
> how familiar you are with live recordings, but:
> this is an audience recording. it can never sound
> as good as professionally recorded things like
> (for example) the roadworks albums. you have to
> keep this in mind. to me the sound of this
> recording is quite average, although i admit, that
> i was a little disappointed on how it turned out
> too. i did better recordings in the past, but i
> also heard some much weaker stuff before. i have
> been trading and taping for about 15 years now, so
> i can call myself quite experienced in that.
>
> well, as i said, just my two cents.
>
> --a.



ok, my (hopefully) last thoughts:

when i fiddle with a liverecording, i simply do that to make it sound more enjoyable, but it never turns out as good as the roadwork or any other band's official live records. this is obviously totally impossible to achieve anyway, which you stated as well, right? and if someone offers to enhance yr bootlegrecording for the better and for you just like that, would you really decline that offer?

i don't care about mp3 or flacs and wavs. that's not my point at all. flac'd mp3's are just nice to bandwith and since we are talking about not-so-very-professional audience recordings, why bother?

so usually i'll do it for myself. i was just so pleased with it that i thought it would be cool for other psychonauts to enjoy as well. but now it's all gone politics... help! and not to be allowed to do some polish on a recording because "i don't like it", sorry, i just can't relate to a thought like that.

i still don't see the problem, only lots of contradictions and statements that don't make sense to me. like: some don't want enhanced bootlegs to be spread, but on the other hand they only accept lossless formats? i'm slightly confused there.

so... i'll keep doing it for myself. people here may express their wishes and we'll see how to deal with this things.

about the concerned MP: ok, i may have underestimated the bigger picture. i looked at this as a nice lil' sharing thing within this community here. meaning: only dedicated mp-freaks would show their interest with good intentions and get their links and sources in here. but since the band is way bigger in norway, i don't know and didn't think about the situation up there concerning etree, rapidshare and whatnot... but internet-crooks wouldn't care about the quality of the recordings anyway i guess. so simply keeping them original and "bad" doesn't help much to stop those people from dealing big time, don't you think? so the question is not about flacs or taping or remastering or not, but about uploading at all.




Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 06/02/2006 01:43AM by supernaut.

Be Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> @Earle
>
> Take it easy. No need to get rude on Anders. He is
> the one who provided everyone with that recording.
> Wheter you like flac/mp3 or remastered versions.
> Without him taping it, we wouldn't even have
> something to argue about. LOL.
>
> I am glad, I can listen to that recording. Period.


Hey, I'm easy! I just think this whole issue about "respect the taper" is pathetic. If you guys are so preoccupied with respect, how's about respecting THE MUSICIANS on stage??? Motorpsycho has stated that they do NOT like people to hear bootlegs (with bad audio) of their concerts.

I can go on an on with my thoughts on this matter, but I'm sick and tired of this discussion (yet somehow I keep reading and posting...).

I miss the good ol' two weeks ago when GBD fed us his wonderful remasters without having to take any shit. Ahh, those were the days. I will never forget it. I will never forget it....



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/02/2006 01:18AM by Earle.

Earle: [email]Youaresuchadisrespectful@idiot.com[/email]


BE: Fyi, 'a' does not stand for Anders.

Mindbogus Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Earle:
> Youaresuc
> ;hadisres�
> 112;ectful@i
> diot.com
>
>
> BE: Fyi, 'a' does not stand for Anders.
>
>
>


Look who's talking.

> BE: Fyi, 'a' does not stand for Anders.
>
>
>


I noticed in the meantime, that I messed that one up, but that's not that important (I know the proper name to the "a".

Hey people

Its junst music and nothing more!!!

tere is no reason to discuss the release of the remastered versions!

do you have no other problems in life ? ;-)


come on you should be more tolerant´

i´m happy to hear differenet (better) versions of this concert

Hey, lets not get into a catfight here, its just music as mellowpsycho correctly writes. No need to call eachother idiots, we're all idiots, idiot. I dont understand what the big fuss is about. I think most of us (I did atleast) respect GBD's efforts to improve the rather bad audio, probably not knowing what sore toes tapers have. And I loved the flow of bootlegs. I will never forget my first listen to the org Darmstadt recording, that record will always be with me (thats some praise!). I cant really understand that the tapers hold such high moral ground, talk of the recordings as 'my work' and 'his work', and that they dont want to share them. Whats that all about? Have you forgotten why you started recording at the first place? Seeing your recording being shared and loved by so many people should be respect enough shouldnt it? Its all pro bono anyway, for the love of the music and mp, nobdys making a dime.

I can in theory understand the wish for flac, but 320 mp3 is not the end of the world when you think about it. I had all my music on tapes when I was young, and that was cool. If its a question of some people not being able to download flacs I dont see why we cant share an mp3 version as well.

So I wish we can get back to business. More shows more fun! More stuff from this tour, it was the bomb. Now we know its up to the taper to decide if his recording can be mp3'd or remastered. If (s)he says no, lets respect that.

Hehe this is what a discussion forum is all about. Discussions!!

Anyway, been reading through some of the posts since my last one, and to me it semes like most of us agree. That an enhanced version in 320kbs mp3 is better then a untouched flac version (ofcourse given the right treatment to it). But still i have to respect the source of the recording. So again. No hard feelings here, just a sigh and an "oh well ..ok then". It was fun to test out my producer skills on these recordings, and i liked the fact that some ppl found them more enjoyable after my treatment. But if the tapers find this annoying and "wrong", then i won't bother them with my versions anymore. I'll simply keep them for myself.

I must admit that i was rather pissed off yesterday. A terrible day at work followed by all those sour posts in here made me lose it for a minute. Tho now i've come to my senses again, and have thought things over. So once again Alex, kornyfone or whoever sitting on fresh material; Let's start with a clean slate here. If you want me to try out some stuff on the recordings, then just send me 1 song to my e-mail below (preferably a link to yousendit or something), and i'll see what i can do. And just to be clear; I'll decode the flacs to wave, remaster and convert back to flac (for the original version...and if someone wants a MP3 version for an easyer download, i don't see the harm in releasing both, as long as we label them thoroughly). What do you say? Lossless format, better sound..everybody's happy? no?

Think about it, and let me know

jakob.scum at gmail.com

Have a good one! I'm off to neverland

fwiw, not every recording needs a remaster. way better recordings than darmstadt have been made during the last tour & most of them def. need no tinkering on the sound (except for whatever personal use). in many cases a remaster won't help anyway because as has been stated before the nature of those audience recordings is amateurish at best, sonically they will not please the casual listener anyway.

i for one am a purist: in most cases i do take audience recordings as they come. trade a little treble for bass or vice versa, enhance whatever fake stereo-picture there might be, i don't care. what is missing in terms of sound-quality i can easily make up in my head with fantasy.

i am not as strictly anti-mp3 as some other folks in here, but i am also a strong supporter of lossless, in fact i think this is the ONLY acceptable way of archiving & collecting recordings but i certainly do appreciate the more democratic charakter of the mp3 format.

i can very well understand GBD's intitial excitement & do appreciate your work for this community. the wishes of the taper should have been stated more clearly in the text file, i guess i am to blame for that.

otherwise, as GBD suggested, let's put this tiresome discussion to rest, respect each other's wishes in the future & enjoy the music again.

peace.
--alex

edited for a typo





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/02/2006 03:59PM by fillmore.

I see your points alex, but i just can't seem to agree with you. I've been a MP fan for years now, and there's hardly no feeling that can compare with the good feel i get from listening to new material, be it a new record or a fresly taped gig (only a truly great fuck perhaps ). But being abit of a sound freak, i can't help getting frustrated by the poor quality that most of these recordings have. Listening to all the great moments that Bent, Snah & co come up with, and thinking how great it could have been to be able to spice up the sound so that i can really enjoy them. That's what made me start doing these remasterings in the first place, as my imagination don't cut it in this case. And since i did it, i found no reason not to share it with the rest of the psychonauts, as i was certain that they felt the same way (atleast as long as they liked what i had done with it). But clearly i was wrong on that one. To me it semes like some of the ppl out there are more interested in slamming the taper rulebook into the table, instead of really getting what me (and others) are doing; Creating even better MP moments for all to enjoy. Cus in my opinion, that's all it is. Many ppl have said that they liked my remastered version better (in spite of the treble flaws). That doesent mean that they dislike the original in any way. Like mentioned, it's an audience recording, and the sound can't be great, no matter how good a taper you are. We're all more than greatful for the shows taped and put on the forum/eTree/whatever, but i think that the majority of listeners agree that the if the sound (and thereby the concert) could be better, one should go for it. Atleast that's my view on the subject

With that said; I'll stop posting shows from now on, since the tapers obviously don't want me to. I don't have to agree with them, but atleast i have the decency to respect their opinion. So there, End of story!