Camp Motorpsycho » General

2018-11-14 Schüür, Luzern

(42 posts)
  • Started 1 month ago by supernaut
  • Latest reply from Juergen

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  1. supernaut
    Member

    Hallo! Sind Zürcher hier, die für die Rückfahrt einen Autositz frei haben? Ich kann als Dank dafür mein +1 auf der Gästeliste offerieren.

    Oder wo schläft dort ein Jugendherbergeschlafsaal-unkompatibler Mensch zu vernünftigen Preisen?

    Posted 1 month ago #
  2. pfnuesel
    Member

    Posted 1 month ago #
  3. Wulf
    Member

    Bartok instead of Fools Gold as Encore

    Posted 1 month ago #
  4. supernaut
    Member

    There's two kinds of MP shows. One of them being the great fun amazing intense ones. The other one, rarer by nature, is the out there one. The big one. The one that answers my question why I keep going to see them. This one was one of those. They don't really differ in playing or sound quality, I find these matters mostly on the same outstanding quality. For me the difference comes with the setlist. And look at this one!!! One fat big number follows another. Even without The Wheel and Starhamster from previous shows, it was still monolithic. Heartattac Mac almost got to Chien's extremes in its noise section, Cuckoo was heavy, August a blast (including Reine getting some lead guitar spot, too), Ship was nuts with sound changes (Bent brought along a mean fuzz pedal, both for bass and guitar), The Tower had a headspinning jam, PPP was graceful, Plan#1 is what it is and Taifun of course came as the extended RWV version, with double bass pedal rumbling by Bent and Snah simultaneously.

    But the high point: Lux Aeterna! Holy smokes! Didn't some write it feels like fitting within The Tower's (the album) vibe? I'd say it would have been an amazing stand out track on TDDU! Jesus, these bold Crimson Court vocal harmonies and then that bass break down gear shifting into complete madness. Can't wait for the new album. Tomas has definitely arrived in the band if I may be so bold to state something like that from my outside consumer's point of view. I mean, they totally gelled. He's it, period. I got the impression he plays more wild and versatile by still being completely within the music than on last tour, where he was more of a "solid and reliable" drummer? But I might remember it wrong, having still been Kapstaded in my head back then... Anyways: YAY! to Tomas!

    I'll see them again tomorrow and maybe Bern, too. Three in a row. But I don't even expect it to be the same massive behemoth like this one. Hmmm maybe Starhammer and The Wheel pop up again, though.

    The Schüür venue btw is wonderful. Hope they liked it and will play there again, it's a great room, like a big shed's attic. Wooden and comfortable. The crowd was very attentive, first I thought there are way too few people waiting in and around but suddenly it was quite full. Surprisingly, considering they play three shows in a row almost within walking distance in this small country.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  5. supernaut
    Member

    btw it was kind of short. 2h15min maybe? But absolutely perfect. There was no need for anything after Bartok. And I even got the last train ride home.

    (speaking of walking distances...)

    Posted 1 month ago #
  6. Kid A
    Member

    TomasIsTheStarhammer

    Posted 1 month ago #
  7. Wow! Thanks for the report, and thanks to everyone sharing their experiences and thoughts here in the forum. It's appreciated.

    I know what you mean about those out-there-shows. Although sometimes you can't even tell from the setlist, I agree that this one looks intense and "out there". Great to see The Tower not as the last song, I hope they keep playing it for a long time to come! The new song. All-time-favorite Heartattack Mac almost reaching Un Chien's extreme. I have had similar experiences with this song, like a mini Chien. PPP is always welcome, and then Bartok for the encore! What a way to go out! Did they do something extra to it? Longer mid-section? Alternative ending? Or was it just like a ton of bricks delivered to your doorstep at midnight? BAM, there you go. Goodnight!

    Posted 1 month ago #
  8. walp
    Member

    I envy the setlist with Year Zero, PPP and Taifun being personal favorites of mine. Nevertheless enjoyed the Erlangen concert very much. Have fun!

    Posted 1 month ago #
  9. Punj Lizard
    Member

    @supernaut - Listening to a couple of the recordings from this mini-tour (Bielefeld and Erlangen) I kinda know what you mean about Tomas. He sounds loose (in the good way), relaxed, confident, unencumbered. I'm really getting off on his playing on these recordings. I'm glad you had such a far out show.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  10. supernaut
    Member

    Anders

    BAM, there you go. Goodnight!

    I think so. Don't quite remember any extended jamming or improv in Bartok, so it probably was not very different than usual. Also the encore break lastet about 5 seconds. They probably were so energized they wanted to go back on stage immediately to rock out one more. Hence Bartok and no Fool's Gold I guess.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  11. pj
    Member

    A review from a friend of mine. First mp show for her and it totally clicked.

    Everyone into music knows..Music can give you everything. Hope, love, strenght..music can be an anchor and a last resort. I knew all that. But tonight I learnt that music can be so much more. I went to see Motorpsycho. I thought a great live show is what was waiting for me. But I was wrong. What awaited me was a complete rearrangement of every last molecule in my body and mind. I am reborn. I have seen tons of amazingly good shows. But this was a whole new level. I cried. A lot. Not out of sadness, but because I felt so liberated and understood and whole. I am not who I was before this Motorpsycho concert. I am changed, I am new. Enlightend. Reborn. If you should ever look for god.. I found something greater tonight.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  12. otherdemon
    Member

    @pj: So she liked it then?

    Beautiful words! I'm pretty sure I felt something similar when I discovered
    Timothy's Monster in the mid-90's. I just wasn't able to articulate it like that
    back then.

    And Triggerman > H.Mac > Plan #1 > Taifun looks like a fantastic row of songs!

    Posted 1 month ago #
  13. supernaut
    Member

    That's why I keep dragging friends along to see them for their first time because for me, like for the most of us, that first time is sadly way gone and it's an empathic illusion of some sort of being back there again, too.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  14. Punj Lizard
    Member

    @pj - Thanks for sharing. Wonderful.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  15. marc
    Member

    I absolutely agree with Tomas being an integral part of the band and that they already turned into a really strong unit! Listening to the recording, it is really impressive what he is doing. Still, neither Kenneth nor Tomas (so far) managed to master the "simple" beat. There is not the slightest bit of doubt about technical proficiency/musicality, but to add brilliance and soul to a simplistic, stupid motor-beat is something you probably cannot practice. A prime example being A.S.F.E.(admittedly a bit unfair with Tomas being new to the band). On record and also live, I think you could hear and see that Tomas doesn't know how to handle that silly fucking beat and it is all a bit drum machine-like Geb would be grooving/punching the shit out of it without unnecessary ornaments and just the right amount of variation and dynamics. If that approach somehow would make its way into Tomas' play every now and then, i would be really happy.

    Sorry for that brief relapse to nostalgia. I am grateful for MP being the band they want to be.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  16. supernaut
    Member

    I have to disagree a bit there. Skill- and soulful playing don't negate each other. And Tomas can't handle ASFE? Quite a bold statement. And wouldn't the band be the first to know and "judge"?

    Posted 1 month ago #
  17. Kid A
    Member

    I know absolutely what marc means. It’s hard to put into words, but there’s this special magic in the old live performances, ,woven by the interplay of the three norsemen, especially in the groove hold together by Bent and Gebhardt. That’s where songs like The Wheel come from

    Posted 1 month ago #
  18. Punj Lizard
    Member

    Interesting discussion. It is true that some drummers can't do both (take Neil Peart for example - a big favourite among rock drummers but not really a groovemeister), but as supernaut says, they don't negate each other. As for Tomas - not sure, maybe you have a point Marc. Will go away and listen to ASFE right this damn moment!

    Posted 1 month ago #
  19. marc
    Member

    Excuse the blasphemy! Yet, the point of a forum is to be able to express one's individual perception/viewpoint...however wrong it might be, right?

    I definitely consider Tomas' play to be skillful AND soulful when being off the leash. But I think it is a real challenge, especially for extraordinarily skilled drummers, to play a simple beat and keep it exciting without artistic shenanigans, but through feeling and intuition. You know, the krauty, Jaki Liebezeit- or, if you will, Geb-like approach to drumming. That said, I really love technical drumming, but a simple groove can serve as a counterpoint to make both aspects even more exciting and effective.

    As for the A.S.F.E. example: Of course tomas handles the song! Please, dude knows how to play! All I am saying is that to me it sounds/feels like it takes him some effort to keep it straight instead of embracing the simplicity of the rhythm and just go for it. It's like a race horse at a pony show.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  20. ThorEgil
    Member

    Lend your ears to Forræderi - Tomas on the drums - for a few minutes and say again that he doesn't know how to play straight forward.
    https://open.spotify.com/album/4BGrWs3YzuQpFI1KemqpTk?si=ElxRb_1fQ4-e6oINuTSBTQ

    Posted 1 month ago #
  21. supernaut
    Member

    @punji
    Neil Peart, what about early records and the Feedback cover album?

    I don't think it's a challenge at all for skilled musicians to play straight'n'simple. Why would it be? But I'm a bit sensitive about this subject since it's been a dogma mantra credo back in my indierock days. Indie police says "It's either this or that", the unwritten rule for some weird reason and it annoyed me already back then. I wonder if in a blind test listening to say four Heartattack Mac live recordings from 1996, 2006, 2010 and 2018 we all could name the drummer? Ok, maybe Kenneth is easy to spot

    Also Bent and Snah have become better players over 20 years naturally, so do they have a hard time nowadays to play STG, Feel, PPP or whatever? I think it's all very hypothetical and beyond reality. Which is my opinion to disagree with

    Posted 1 month ago #
  22. Punj Lizard
    Member

    @supernaut
    Peart can play that stuff ok (as you say, it's not one or the other), I just don't see it as his forte. There are a lot of drummers who can't do what he can (or as well as he can), but can do amazing groove till the cows come home. It's just a matter of some drummers being better at one thing than another - like some guitarists are great shredders but not as good as others at playing great rhythm. No criticism from my side of Peart, Geb or Tomas - I think all three are great, but they each have their own style and areas of expertise, which in some areas overlap and others don't. Compare Peart with Bruford - Peart could never play the way Bruford does on, say, Starless and Bruford could never play the way Peart does on, say, Tom Sawyer. And even if they could, why would they want to?

    EDIT: So I just listened to both For What It's Worth and Mr Soul from the Feedback album. The first, apart from Alex's lead contributions, leaves me pretty cold. It certainly has none of the soul of the original (and that includes Peart's drumming), though it's a competent enough cover. The second was a little more engaging but again the drumming feels much like a run-through. Doesn't stop Peart being one of my all-time favourite drummers by some distance. The funny thing is, his groove does come through during, for example, the mid-section of Jacob's Ladder, where the patterns are more complex but he uses them to drive the song forward like very few else do. Subdivisions might be another example - he's pushing the groove, but not with simple beats, even though it's a straighforward song. He's playing all around the beat but still keeping it on point, and that's part of where his brilliance lies for me. Than again I might be dreaming

    Posted 1 month ago #
  23. Bartok
    Member

    Lux Aeterna! Wow, can’t wait, sounds like a MP classic already, just by the name. But. Can anyone *please* upload it on YouTube? Just a humble wish from someone without Dime/Motortrade capability. Thanx!

    Posted 1 month ago #
  24. grindove
    Member

    I've always thought that the "stiff"/"ungroovy"/"non-dynamic" drumming in "ASFE" was totally intentional and on purpose - probably the songwriter's or the producer's idea - as an effect. How many crashes do you even count in the song? It's just pumping bassdrum/ride and snare just about all the way through. Definitely "a thing", I'd say. I think Geb wouldn't manage to get THAT straight/stiff/machine-like feel to it, and I believe Kenneth wouldn't want to
    Guessing? Me?! A lot!

    Posted 1 month ago #
  25. supernaut
    Member

    Yes ASFE is a robotic machine groove. There's not much to swing about. I'm curious why they dropped this one so early from the setlist last year and didn't show up this time around either.

    Punj
    I'm totally with you about the guitar shredders without any sense of rhythm. And "And even if they could, why would they want to?" sums it up nicely. Individualism is the key.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  26. otherdemon
    Member

    @supernaut: IMHO they were not able to create a satisfactory live version of ASFE. Even though it's not my favorite track on The Tower, they were able to make a good studio version, especially the ending with all the voices chanting the chorus hypnotically and Snah soloing furiously over it. Live on the other hand, it became very feeble, monotonous and pointless without the studio enhancements (at least from the recordings I've heard) So I honestly don't miss it in a live setting; they're playing plenty of other goodies anyway!

    That's my 2 cents, at least

    Posted 1 month ago #
  27. Punj Lizard
    Member

    @supernaut - at least we agreed on some things And thanks for prompting me to go back and listen to some old (and not so old) Rush again. It's been a while. And sometimes you discover things aren't what you thought they were.

    @otherdemon and supernaut - They opened with ASFE in London - my first ever MP gig, and I exploded. I thought it was a perfect opener, full of mad energy that just made me want to relive my punk youth and start pogoing! Not so easy at 55. I couldn't so easily imagine it in the middle of a set though.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  28. otherdemon
    Member

    @Punj: I've only heard recordings of ASFE; they always skipped it at the gigs I attended.
    So it might be a case of it sounding more convincing IRL.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  29. Punj Lizard
    Member

    @otherdemon - Yeah, maybe. Or maybe I was just high on being at my first MP gig and other stuff. It's all so subjective. At Roadburn this year one of my friend's said he found the improvisatory noodling at the beginning of Un Chien was dreadful, just screechy and pointless. He was up in the balcony. I was on the floor, dead centre, about ten rows back and to me it was glorious. He said there were no bass tones or rhythm to ground it. I was shocked. I asked, did you not hear Bent's three repeated bass notes [like in the Roadworks Köln recording] giving the whole thing form, direction and grounding? No, he replied. Oh well. You never really know.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  30. marc
    Member

    Oh, what did I spark!

    @ThorEgil Thank you for the link! Consider me proven wrong... a little! That is definitely straight forward playing. Like I said, I don't question Tomas' capability to play such stuff, yet hardcore/metal drumming is a bit of a different story though I think. Maybe "groove" is what puts the finger on it more precisely.

    @supernaut Sorry for opening old wounds! But "Indie police"....ouch, that hurt
    Of course, you're perfectly right that they became better players and I definitely don't want them to return to the past. I perfectly understand that they have to keep it exciting and challenging for themselves.

    @grindove Yes, as you point out that "static" drumming certainly was on porpuse. For me, it doesn't fully carry the song though. That is exactly my point. I think that, while sticking to the straight beat, some minimal dynamics/variations could have breathed more life into the recording.

    Posted 1 month ago #

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